Maintaining Human Intelligence in the AI Era | David Krakauer (President of the Santa Fe Institute)

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David Krakauer is a leading complex systems researcher and the president of the Santa Fe Institute, a unique institution dedicated to studying complex systems across disciplines. In this episode, David challenges conventional wisdom about AI, arguing that large language models pose a more immediate threat to humanity than commonly discussed existential risks—not by destroying us directly, but by eroding our cognitive capabilities through addictive, low-quality information.

We explore:

• Why David believes LLMs aren't intelligent at all and how the AI community misunderstands emergence

• The three dimensions of intelligence: inference, representation, and strategy—and which one LLMs lack

• How AI acts as a "competitive" rather than "complementary" cognitive technology, atrophying our thinking abilities

• What makes great minds unique, from analogical reasoning to the cultivation of unconscious creativity

• How Cormac McCarthy's approach to knowledge and creativity offers lessons for the AI age

• Why David believes the greatest threat from AI isn't existential risk but cognitive atrophy

• How to protect your mind against AI's addictive pull and maintain cognitive autonomy

Explore the episode

Timestamps

(00:00) Intro

(04:39) The Santa Fe Institute’s approach to complex systems

(06:45) Murray Gell-Mann’s ‘Odysseus vs. Apollonian’

(10:35) How SFI was shaped by the legacy of Los Alamos

(12:45) Traits David looks for in great minds

(14:43) Cormac McCarthy on naivety and how thoughtful people treat knowledge

(19:24) A simple explanation of complexity science

(22:50) Why vantage point doesn’t matter when studying systems

(24:36) Aesthetic preferences among complexity scientists

(26:07) Films and directors with complexity science themes

(29:57) Why David argues LLMs are not intelligent

(32:10) What’s missing in the study of LLMs

(36:40) The three qualities of intelligence and how LLMs measure up

(42:19) Lessons from "The Glass Bead Game"

(44:00) David’s perspective on reinforcement learning

(45:38) The greatest threat of LLMs: overreliance and the decline of thinking

(47:40) Competitive vs. complementary cognitive artifacts

(51:55) Why exposing yourself to quality ideas matters

(54:00) How to derisk LLM use

(58:32) Cormac McCarthy’s legacy at SFI and